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#1 User is offline   MTP Reggie 

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Posted 11 August 2019 - 12:43 PM

Red Flag Laws are Not a Magical Solution to Gun Violence
Jose Nino
August 8, 2019
The Advocates

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Last weekend's spurt of mass shootings in Dayton, Ohio and El Paso, Texas has brought the dreaded gun control debate back into the mix.

Combine that with identity politics, and we have all the makings for unproductive discussions on public policy.

The media have been quick to blame white supremacy and associate President Donald Trump with this shooting. The shooter's manifesto is filled with hateful language and anti-immigrant sentiment, which should be condemned. But there's more to this story than meets the eye.

First of all, white Americans are not the only group carrying out gun violence.

Journalist Zaid Jilani pointed out that there were two mass shootings in Chicago on the night of August 3, 2019. This was the same day that the El Paso massacre took place. He argues that gun violence in Chicago "has become so normalized it doesn't even make national news."

Reports from CBS Chicago indicate that three people were killed and 40 were wounded last weekend. Four shootings occurred on August 2, 12 shootings on August 3, and five shootings on August 4. CBS also reported that there were "two mass shootings overnight in Chicago both in the West Side's Lawndale neighborhood."

The state of Illinois has stringent gun controls which include red flag gun confiscation laws. Despite having these laws present, shootings take place regularly. Chicago is one of the urban centers that epitomizes the failure of gun control policies.

While most mainstream conservatives get this at face value, they still are under the illusion that they can make certain gun control schemes work. GOP politicians like Congressman Dan Crenshaw and Senator Lindsey Graham ignore this at their own constituents' peril as they champion red flag gun confiscation orders as the "solution" to America's supposed gun violence "crisis."

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#2 User is offline   Dean Adam Smithee 

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Posted 11 August 2019 - 04:16 PM

If someone can explain to me the difference between "Red Flag" and "Profiling", then I can explain why "Red Flag" won't work in Chicago EITHER.

Seriously.

That said, I philosophically agree with the concept of "Red Flag", I just don't think we need a slew of laws to get there. Most states already have an equivalent of what in Florida is called the "Baker Act". Use it. And, despite all the armchair HEARSAY and SPECULATION about potential abuses, it's a fairly high bar to get Baker Acted in Florida. I mean, we're not talking about merely the word of someone with a grudge or a nosy neighbor; In FL at least, it takes either a sworn badged LEO or a licensed professional who sees specific behavior with their own eyes and/or hears specific threats with their own ears... at the risk of losing their badge or license for filing a false report maliciously.

FL has an interesting idea on their D/Ls: Go ten years without a ticket, and you get a "Safe Driver" designation on your License.

https://www.flhsmv.gov/wp-content/uploads/MODDL-DL-FRONT-72RES-1.png
photo courtesy FL Dept of Highway Safety and Motor Vehicles (FLHSMV)

HOW ABOUT
the same concept of "Safe Citizen"? 10 years, No mental health issues, no arrests for even misdemeanors.
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#3 User is offline   Rock N' Roll Right Winger 

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Posted 11 August 2019 - 10:29 PM

View PostDean Adam Smithee, on 11 August 2019 - 04:16 PM, said:

If someone can explain to me the difference between "Red Flag" and "Profiling", then I can explain why "Red Flag" won't work in Chicago EITHER.

Seriously.

That said, I philosophically agree with the concept of "Red Flag", I just don't think we need a slew of laws to get there. Most states already have an equivalent of what in Florida is called the "Baker Act". Use it. And, despite all the armchair HEARSAY and SPECULATION about potential abuses, it's a fairly high bar to get Baker Acted in Florida. I mean, we're not talking about merely the word of someone with a grudge or a nosy neighbor; In FL at least, it takes either a sworn badged LEO or a licensed professional who sees specific behavior with their own eyes and/or hears specific threats with their own ears... at the risk of losing their badge or license for filing a false report maliciously.

FL has an interesting idea on their D/Ls: Go ten years without a ticket, and you get a "Safe Driver" designation on your License.

https://www.flhsmv.gov/wp-content/uploads/MODDL-DL-FRONT-72RES-1.png
photo courtesy FL Dept of Highway Safety and Motor Vehicles (FLHSMV)

HOW ABOUT
the same concept of "Safe Citizen"? 10 years, No mental health issues, no arrests for even misdemeanors.

One is presumed innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around.

Why not put "convicted felon" on the licenses of convicted felons instead? Felons have forfeited their rights on such because they were proven guilty and convicted with due process.

The onus should never be put upon the innocent people to have to prove themselves not guilty on anything.
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