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Ladybird

Alex Jones, Pursued Over Infowars Falsehoods, Faces a Legal Crossroads

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Ladybird

Alex Jones, Pursued Over Infowars Falsehoods, Faces a Legal Crossroads

 

By Elizabeth Williamson

July 31, 2018

AUSTIN, Tex. — In the five years since Noah Pozner was killed at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., death threats and online harassment have forced his parents, Veronique De La Rosa and Leonard Pozner, to relocate seven times. They now live in a high-security community hundreds of miles from where their 6-year-old is buried.

 

“I would love to go see my son’s grave and I don’t get to do that, but we made the right decision,” Ms. De La Rosa said in a recent interview. Each time they have moved, online fabulists stalking the family have published their whereabouts.

 

“With the speed of light,” she said. “They have their own community, and they have the ear of some very powerful people.”

 

On Wednesday in an Austin courtroom, the struggle of the Sandy Hook families to hold to account Alex Jones, a powerful leader of this online community, will reach a crossroads. Lawyers for Noah Pozner’s parents will seek to convince a Texas judge that they — and by extension the families of eight other victims in the 2012 shooting that killed 20 first graders and six adults — have a valid defamation claim against Mr. Jones, whose Austin-based Infowars media operation spread false claims that the shooting was an elaborate hoax.

 

The Pozner hearing is a bellwether in three cases, including another in Texas and one in Connecticut, filed by relatives of nine Sandy Hook victims. It comes as the social media platforms Mr. Jones relies upon to spread incendiary claims initiate efforts to curb him.

 

The day after the Pozner case, in the same courthouse, is a hearing in a separate defamation case against Mr. Jones brought by Marcel Fontaine, who was falsely identified on Infowars’ website as the gunman in the Parkland, Fla., school shooting in February. Mr. Fontaine, who lives in Massachusetts, has never visited Florida. The Pozner family and Mr. Fontaine are being represented by Mark Bankston of Farrar & Ball, a law firm based in Houston.

 

<snip>

 

Last week Mr. Jones broadcast a bizarre accusation that Robert S. Mueller III, the special counsel investigating Russian interference in the 2016 election, was involved in a child sex ring. In an online broadcast, Mr. Jones addressed Mr. Mueller while repeatedly imitating firing a handgun, saying: “It’s the real world. Politically. You’re going to get it, or I’m going to die trying.”

 

Recent “most popular” stories on the Infowars website included “Marine Veteran, Man Wearing Trump Shirt Violently Attacked Near Trump Star in L.A.,” “Revealed: U.N. Plan to Flood America With 600 Million Migrants,” and “Left Protests ‘Racist’ Stand Your Ground Law After Black Man Shot in Self-Defense.”

 

On Friday, Facebook removed Mr. Jones’s personal page from the site for 30 days, citing “bullying” and “hate speech.” The company has yet to take any action against the Infowars Facebook page, despite pleas from Sandy Hook parents. Last week, YouTube removed four of Mr. Jones’s videos for violating its child endangerment and hate speech standards and barred him from live-streaming on the site for 90 days, though his channel remains a main source for his broadcasts.

 

The videos removed included one called “Prevent Liberalism,” in which a man chokes a child and throws him to the ground. Another one was called “Shock Report: Learn How Islam Has Already Conquered Europe.”

 

<snip>

 

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MontyPython

Good. I hope Jones gets exactly what he deserves. It's bad enough that there are people out there who are stupid enough to believe Sandy Hook was a "hoax" :rolleyes:, but to hound the families of the children who were murdered is beyond sick.

 

<_<

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oki

Good. I hope Jones gets exactly what he deserves. It's bad enough that there are people out there who are stupid enough to believe Sandy Hook was a "hoax" :rolleyes:, but to hound the families of the children who were murdered is beyond sick.

 

<_<

 

 

Exactly, the man has a right to say what he wishes. But at the same time people have a right to hold him sue him.

Be it a radio show host or a politician they cater to an audience. For better or worse that's how it works.

 

Oki

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corporal_little

Good. I hope they hammer the jackass.

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SARGE

NEWSLASH

 

Alex Jones is a Moron

 

I hope they literally own him.

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Dean Adam Smithee

Fontaine probably has a case; I don't see how Pozner et al do.

 

I'm no fan of Alex Jones. But I don't see how Alex Jones broadcasting an "Opinion" and/or a "Theory" that Sandy Hook was a hoax rises to the level of "Defamation". It's a pretty high bar: You have to KNOW that what you're saying is wrong AND you have to then say it anyway with malicious intent.

 

It sucks that these families were harassed. And, yeah, it wouldn't surprise me at all if the harassers were Jones's follower. But it's a long way from there to connecting it to Jones personally. How do you prove that he intended it to happen?

 

BESIDES, Alex Jones has an airtight defense if needed: The Insanity Plea. Just show clips of his show to the jury:

 

"Your honor, I present 'Exhibit 'A'' through 'Exhibit 'Z'' and rest my case."

 

The whole trial would be over in 30 minutes, tops.

Edited by Dean Adam Smithee

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Magic Rat

Jones is an ass and anyone who buys his crap is a moron. However, he has he right to 'believe' or say he believes whatever the hell he wants. It's too bad that these people feel harassed by his moith breathing fans but I don't see how Jones can be held legally responsible unless he's somehow compelling them to do so.

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Dean Adam Smithee

Jones is an ass and anyone who buys his crap is a moron. However, he has he right to 'believe' or say he believes whatever the hell he wants. It's too bad that these people feel harassed by his moith breathing fans but I don't see how Jones can be held legally responsible unless he's somehow compelling them to do so.

 

Exactly.

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gravelrash

Jones is an ass and anyone who buys his crap is a moron. However, he has he right to 'believe' or say he believes whatever the hell he wants. It's too bad that these people feel harassed by his moith breathing fans but I don't see how Jones can be held legally responsible unless he's somehow compelling them to do so.

 

From what I have heard from Alex Jones, he's no Barack Obama. Nor is he a Maxine Waters. I agree. The guy is a douchebag but he hasn't called specifically for "getting in their faces", "bringing a gun to a knife fight", or "harassing them at gas stations".

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Ladybird

From what I have heard from Alex Jones, he's no Barack Obama. Nor is he a Maxine Waters. I agree. The guy is a douchebag but he hasn't called specifically for "getting in their faces", "bringing a gun to a knife fight", or "harassing them at gas stations".

 

Spreading stories about those he disagrees with being pedophiles. No harm there. Just ask the owner of that pizza shop.

 

 

This was in the OP, btw..

Last week Mr. Jones broadcast a bizarre accusation that Robert S. Mueller III, the special counsel investigating Russian interference in the 2016 election, was involved in a child sex ring. In an online broadcast, Mr. Jones addressed Mr. Mueller while repeatedly imitating firing a handgun, saying: “It’s the real world. Politically. You’re going to get it, or I’m going to die trying.”

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gravelrash

Spreading stories about those he disagrees with being pedophiles. No harm there. Just ask the owner of that pizza shop.

 

 

This was in the OP, btw..

 

Insufficient and irrelevant. You can say all sorts of crazy and parrot conspiracy theories. It's your right as an American. You shouldn't specifically incite violence against individuals, political opponents, or people whom you just don't like (like Obama and Waters have a penchant for). That's just good old-fashioned civility and manners.

 

If someone is "inspired" then feels compelled to act irrationally or violently because of what you say? Yes, you should choose your words carefully with thought, wisdom, and foresight. Ultimately, it's on them not you. It's the plausible deniability specified in "Rules for Radicals".

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Ladybird

Insufficient and irrelevant. You can say all sorts of crazy and parrot conspiracy theories. It's your right as an American. You shouldn't specifically incite violence against individuals, political opponents, or people whom you just don't like (like Obama and Waters have a penchant for). That's just good old-fashioned civility and manners.

 

If someone is "inspired" then feels compelled to act irrationally or violently because of what you say? Yes, you should choose your words carefully with thought, wisdom, and foresight. Ultimately, it's on them not you. It's the plausible deniability specified in "Rules for Radicals".

 

 

"What about these other people!" Jones is not so bad because these other people (in your opinion) are worse? Unjustly accusing anyone of being a pedophile is disgraceful..

 

It's a lie that Waters called for violence against anyone.

Edited by Ladybird

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gravelrash

"What about these other people!" Jones is not so bad because these other people (in your opinion) are worse? Unjustly accusing anyone of being a pedophile is disgraceful..

 

It's a lie that Waters called for violence against anyone.

 

Accusing someone of being a pedophile is disgusting and reprehensible. It says more about Alex Jones than his targets. He's a no-trick gelding.

 

Calling for public harassment is advocating violence. You're confusing physical violence with nuanced psychological attacks. Triggers that send people to therapists for crayons and cocoa. To claim that Waters is not calling for violence is a lie. Which make you a liar. See, I just went into the next stage of "Rules for Radicals".

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SARGE

"What about these other people!" Jones is not so bad because these other people (in your opinion) are worse? Unjustly accusing anyone of being a pedophile is disgraceful..

 

It's a lie that Waters called for violence against anyone.

 

 

You really need to make that your signature. :coolshades:

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Ladybird

You really need to make that your signature. :coolshades:

 

Clearly not understanding why I wrote those words.

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MontyPython

It's a lie that Waters called for violence against anyone.

 

Bullsh*t. You lost that argument a long time ago. He's what she said:

 

"If you see anybody from that cabinet in a restaurant, in a department store, at a gasoline station, you get out and you create a crowd. You push back on them. Tell them they’re not welcome anymore, anywhere!"

 

You realize physically pushing somebody equals violence, right? Yes I know, LOL, you'll try to pass it off with something like "she didn't mean it literally" :rolleyes:. But until you can guarantee not one single person on earth takes it literally, there's no honest way to pretend she didn't openly call for violence.

 

B)

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Ladybird

Bullsh*t. You lost that argument a long time ago. He's what she said:

 

"If you see anybody from that cabinet in a restaurant, in a department store, at a gasoline station, you get out and you create a crowd. You push back on them. Tell them theyre not welcome anymore, anywhere!"

 

You realize physically pushing somebody equals violence, right? Yes I know, LOL, you'll try to pass it off with something like "she didn't mean it literally" :rolleyes:. But until you can guarantee not one single person on earth takes it literally, there's no honest way to pretend she didn't openly call for violence.

 

B)

 

She said "tell them". That does not mean physically touching someone. Wrap yourself in pretzels and declare yourself 'the winner', but it doesn't change the fact that she didn't tell anyone to go out and do violence.

 

If the phrase 'push back on them' was meant as a call to violence, every board room in this country would be a blood bath.

 

It is a figure of speech.

Edited by Ladybird

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gravelrash

She said "tell them". That does not mean physically touching someone. Wrap yourself in pretzels and declare yourself 'the winner', but it doesn't change the fact that she didn't tell anyone to go out and do violence.

 

If the phrase 'push back on them' was meant as a call to violence, every board room in this country would be a blood bath.

 

It is a figure of speech.

 

Yes, a figure of speech, maybe a metaphor. Queen Maxine and Kwing Barry told the loyal opposition to "get in their face". Poo-poo that to rhetoric softer than "Time to squeeze the Charmin". Ever notice that Mr. Whipple looked a lot like the Duncan Donuts' guy?

 

Nope, your side advocates violence to silence. It has been forever. Phone and pen did a lot of damage to America's economy for eight years. Love, PRESIDENT Donald J. Trump comes along and waves his "magic wand".

 

Next thing you know, the economy is humming. The bartender asks me where I buy my pumps (Anthropologie). And we're kind of sort of laughing at your posts right now.

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MontyPython

She said "tell them". That does not mean physically touching someone. Wrap yourself in pretzels and declare yourself 'the winner', but it doesn't change the fact that she didn't tell anyone to go out and do violence.

 

If the phrase 'push back on them' was meant as a call to violence, every board room in this country would be a blood bath.

 

It is a figure of speech.

 

She said "tell them" in the following sentence; the sentence after she called for physical violence.

 

You're the only one twisting yourself into pretzels.

 

B)

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Kilmerfan

Fontaine probably has a case; I don't see how Pozner et al do.

 

I'm no fan of Alex Jones. But I don't see how Alex Jones broadcasting an "Opinion" and/or a "Theory" that Sandy Hook was a hoax rises to the level of "Defamation". It's a pretty high bar: You have to KNOW that what you're saying is wrong AND you have to then say it anyway with malicious intent.

 

It sucks that these families were harassed. And, yeah, it wouldn't surprise me at all if the harassers were Jones's follower. But it's a long way from there to connecting it to Jones personally. How do you prove that he intended it to happen?

 

BESIDES, Alex Jones has an airtight defense if needed: The Insanity Plea. Just show clips of his show to the jury:

 

"Your honor, I present 'Exhibit 'A'' through 'Exhibit 'Z'' and rest my case."

 

The whole trial would be over in 30 minutes, tops.

:yeahthat:

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Taggart Transcontinental

Fontaine probably has a case; I don't see how Pozner et al do.

 

I'm no fan of Alex Jones. But I don't see how Alex Jones broadcasting an "Opinion" and/or a "Theory" that Sandy Hook was a hoax rises to the level of "Defamation". It's a pretty high bar: You have to KNOW that what you're saying is wrong AND you have to then say it anyway with malicious intent.

 

It sucks that these families were harassed. And, yeah, it wouldn't surprise me at all if the harassers were Jones's follower. But it's a long way from there to connecting it to Jones personally. How do you prove that he intended it to happen?

 

BESIDES, Alex Jones has an airtight defense if needed: The Insanity Plea. Just show clips of his show to the jury:

 

"Your honor, I present 'Exhibit 'A'' through 'Exhibit 'Z'' and rest my case."

 

The whole trial would be over in 30 minutes, tops.

 

But remember he's a fringe right winger so he's guilty of anything the left claims.

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Ladybird

Accusing someone of being a pedophile is disgusting and reprehensible. It says more about Alex Jones than his targets. He's a no-trick gelding.

 

Calling for public harassment is advocating violence. You're confusing physical violence with nuanced psychological attacks. Triggers that send people to therapists for crayons and cocoa. To claim that Waters is not calling for violence is a lie. Which make you a liar. See, I just went into the next stage of "Rules for Radicals".

Accusations of child molestation can get someone killed. Are you kidding?

 

And I notice you conveniently left off Jones’ comments about Mueller.

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Kilmerfan

You ban something you just make it more popular.

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Ladybird

You ban something you just make it more popular.

 

I don’t agree with banning anyone’s free speech, even this obnoxious blowhard.

 

Being that they are not the government, Facebook and Apple can host any speech or enforce any guidelines they wish.

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Ladybird

Fontaine probably has a case; I don't see how Pozner et al do.

 

I'm no fan of Alex Jones. But I don't see how Alex Jones broadcasting an "Opinion" and/or a "Theory" that Sandy Hook was a hoax rises to the level of "Defamation". It's a pretty high bar: You have to KNOW that what you're saying is wrong AND you have to then say it anyway with malicious intent.

 

It sucks that these families were harassed. And, yeah, it wouldn't surprise me at all if the harassers were Jones's follower. But it's a long way from there to connecting it to Jones personally. How do you prove that he intended it to happen?

 

BESIDES, Alex Jones has an airtight defense if needed: The Insanity Plea. Just show clips of his show to the jury:

 

"Your honor, I present 'Exhibit 'A'' through 'Exhibit 'Z'' and rest my case."

 

The whole trial would be over in 30 minutes, tops.

 

If he specifically pointed to these families and claimed they were liars and actors in some elaborate hoax, would that not border on slander?

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